Dear Mr. Wilber,

About 2 weeks ago I have send you an email regarding the “queen city”.
I was curious if you were able to read my email and are willing to replay on this story.
If you did not receive my email regarding the “queen city” I can send you a copy of this email.  


Regards Peter van der Linden

Peter, Sorry for the late reply-I sometimes forget I have a forum. I know abit about the downing of the "Queen City". I didn't recieve your e mail so please give it to me again.

doug wilber

doug,i have send you my email again.
greetings.

Doug,

My first email contains 4 word documents and my second email contains some pictures.
I hope you will receive them.
If not I will try to post it in some another way to you.

peter.

Peter, My e mail address is Tball4923@aol.com. Use that one because I still have not gotten anything.

doug

Doug, i have send you my emails a second time with no problems on my side to Tball4923@aol.com
maybe its possible that there is a problem at your side.
Do you have another adres if you are not able to receive them?

its alsowe possible to copy my story to this forum but i don't know what to do whit my pictures then.(registration plate of the willy's jeep)
maybe you have a option on that.
you can alsowe reach me on my email vanderlinden2@home.nl.

Peter, I would like to post any information or pictures of the Willy jeep that was on the "Queen City". I talked 5 years ago with glider pilot  George Anderson who was the best friend of F/O Noel McCann who piloted the Queen City. The "Queen City" is named after McCann's hometown of Cincinnati, Ohio. He saw his       friend die in seconds after the wing was shot off by the Germans just before they approached their target, Landing Zone W, near Son. Since it hit at such a great rate of speed Anderson doubted the German claim that they used the jeep aboard the CG-4A Waco which killed three members of my Dad's unit and           McCann. If the Germans did use it that would be something. I would have to see if I can find the            manifast for the Queen City to see if that matches the registration #.

Doug Wilber

Peter, I would like to post any information or pictures of the Willy jeep that was on the "Queen City". I talked 5 years ago with glider pilot  George Anderson who was the best friend of F/O Noel McCann who piloted the Queen City. The "Queen City" is named after McCann's hometown of Cincinnati, Ohio. He saw his       friend die in seconds after the wing was shot off by the Germans just before they approached their target, Landing Zone W, near Son. Since it hit at such a great rate of speed Anderson doubted the German claim that they used the jeep aboard the CG-4A Waco which killed three members of my Dad's unit and           McCann. If the Germans did use it that would be something. I would have to see if I can find the            manifast for the Queen City to see if that matches the registration #.

Doug Wilber

doug, i have replayed your email directly so i can not do any thing else.
but because i am bussy with this story for some time now, and this email thing is making me a bit sad i will post it all directly on your forum.
its even giving me some sleeples nights.
its at this time 1.45 am in holland so here we go

                                                                                                         April 2008

Dear Mr. Wilber

May I first introduce myself.
My name is Peter van der Linden, age 36.
I live in a small village in Holland, called Oisterwijk.
I’m e-mailing you because I have in my possession further information regarding the “Queen City”.
As  you already know the Queen City crashed in our village on sept. 18th, 1944.
Some of the information from your website I gave to my new neighbours as they don’t own a computer.
In return they provided me with the following.
The Willy’s Jeep, which was part of the cargo of the of the unfortunate glider, survived the crash and was claimed by the German Forces.
The German army unit (245 Division) had a “Sanitaets” Company (Divisional Dressing Station) in Oisterwijk.
This “Feld Lazarett” (Field Dressing Station) was under the command of “Stabsartz” (Doctor in Charge) Dr Zink who took the Jeep in his possession, removed the white star and used it as his “dienstauto”  (staffcar).
After the war doctor De Sain, our local G,P at that time, came into the possession of the Jeep and used it to visit his patients.
Rumor says that at a later date the jeep was painted yellow to the grieve of some of the villagers.
Years later it was sold to an unknown buyer.
At present an old American Army Jeep, now painted red, can be seen at some festive occasions.
Is this the Jeep from the glider ?  Who knows ?.

Memoirs of Dr De Sain, 1888-1959

Dr De Sain was during the war and the years after G.P. in the village of Oisterwijk.
He was also the head of the Red Cross in this area.
Do to the effort of Dr De Sain and Pastoor (local priest) van Kemenade, who contacted the British forces, risking their own lives, Oisterwijk was saved from further destruction and was liberated on October 26, 1944.
The exact number of casualties on the allied side is not known, but there are 14 war graves in the cemetery of the st Petrus church in our village.
During the liberation the church, used by the Germans as an observation post, was to a great extend damaged.
Photos taken in the days after the liberation are in my possession and can be made available.
According to non-confirmed information Dr De Sain kept a dairy of the events that occurred during these years and accumulated them into his memoirs.
As Dr De Sain has passed away this cannot be verified.
If any of his writings ever have been published is also not known.
It would be of great interest if any of his papers could be traced and made available to the public.

xtract from the book “Oorlog in Oisterwijk” (war in Oisterwijk) published in the Netherlands in 1984, 40 years after the liberation.

Translation

The following day (18 sept 1944) the air was again covered with the black silhouettes of numerous aircrafts.
The anti-aircraft gun at kerkhoven came again into action and was able to hit a Waco-Glider (later known as the Queen City) which was being pulled by a Dakota aircraft.
The wing of the glider was shot off, the Dakota directly disengaged the towing cable and the glider fell as a leave to the ground landing in a ditch along side the kerkhovensebaan.
In the glider were four soldiers and a Jeep.
The four occupants were crushed by the Jeep which landed on top of them.
All four must have been killed instantly.
Shortly after the incident some people living nearby came to the crash site.
Also the German authorities arrived shortly after.
The wreck was of little interest as the crash destroyed the glider completely.
On the other hand the Jeep, a vehicle unknown to the Germans, was still in good condition and created a lot of interest .
Also the towing rope, made of nylon, which was found some time later was something new to everybody.
The German military confiscated the Jeep, they over painted the white star on the hood and used it as a “staff Car”.
A photocopy of the registration plate belonging to the Jeep is included in this e-mail.
The body’s of the four soldiers were taken away and later buried by pastoor van Kemenade in the local church yard.
The same day a number of other aircrafts were hit and damaged by the German air defense at kerkhoven.
A four-engine Liberator crashed near the area of Winkel in Udenhout,  the entire crew was killed.
Near Huize Assisie an other Dakota with damaged engines crash landed.

Sofar a rough translation of the article under the heading “Oorlogsgeweld” (violence of war).

According to our information the four occupants of the Waco-Glider were,
1st ltn.   R.J Hiltunen  011 03 214
Tech 5  R.J Le May   362 38 013
Pvt        R.L Carson   361 16 352
Fl.Off   NO McCann          ?

The names of these four soldiers are engraved on a plaque located in a little chapel dedicated to the Holy Mary near our village.

The bodies of the four soldiers, which were first buried at the local church yard, were at a later date relocated to an American War Grave Cemetary.
Hiltunen, Le May and Carson are now buried at the American War Cemetary in Margraten, Limburg, Netherlands.
As far as known Fl Off McCann was repatriated  and is buried somewhere in Kentucky.
These four soldiers who died close to our home are by us regarded as “Oisterwijkers” and we made it a habit to visit their graves in Margraten at regular intervals sometimes laying a few flowers as a “thank You”.

As written in your article published on the internet the greatgranddaughter of Fl. Off McCann
is still looking for information about her grandfather.
I hope that this e-mail will reach her and give her a little more understanding about the last days of this member of her family




                                                                                      Best Regards,

ps if you also could replay by email ,i will on request print it out for my heighbours.
they are also taken by this story and are also regular visitors of margraten every year to pay their respect to the crew of the "queen city".
My heighbour is 80 years old and like me  interested in ww2.
when British veterans vissited holland a few times on labor day at 5 mei a few years back they stayed at their home.

we will see how to get over the photo's of the registration plate xtracted from the book “Oorlog in Oisterwijk” (war in Oisterwijk)   and others, and if it is a match.

Peter, Thank you so much for all the information about the "Queen City" glider # 42-79151. What amazes me the most is that the jeep was used again by the Germans. That would be something if the jeep was found out today. Peter, where is your village exactly. I was over in Holland four years ago and if I ever get to Holland again I would like to visit your village. Next year is the 65th anniversity of Operation Market-Garden and a company out in California plans on landing a newly built Waco as part of the celebration. I hope to be on that glider in tribute to my Dad, all the glidermen and all the veterans   of that war.

Doug,oisterwijk is near the town of tilburg and eindhoven.
You could find it with google earth.
Its also relativly close to the landingzone's near son,about a 20 min drive.

Peter, I was very pleased to read that your village adopted my Dad's dead brothers from the 326th AEB and F/O McCann. You know all three men of the 326th can be found on page 58 on this website. Carson was just one man over from my Dad. After World War II all of the Americans buried in your country was adopted by your citizens. What a fine tribute that is to our dead from that war. My Dad was greatly affected by the war and every day he wondered why he survived while others died. It just never goes away.

doug wilber

Doug, I will see what I can do with my digital and old pictures.
Because you did not mention them I assume they did not reach you.
I think the best way to do it is to collect them en get them over to you by  mail.
But I have to go to the photographer and let him make copy’s of them.

Peter.

Peter, I got your e mail with the attached pictures. Where in Normandy was that picture taken?

doug wilber

Hey doug, I only just read your post because I was on a short holyday for the weekend.
I am very glad to hear  that the pictures came true to your address , only I don’t know if the email was received at your address?? Can you please tell me how??  I hope you can read the registration number and if it will match because according to the story over here it should be the reg.number of the willy’s jeep that survived the crash in oisterwijk
The photo of me was taken at . Batterie de Longues  in normandie france at goldbeach.
Its at a german observation bunker as seen in the movie d-day.
We call it “pluskats”bunker named after the leading officer of it  that at d-day morning got the first look of the great armada and phoned with erwin rommel.
I made a trip to normandie in 2006 and 2007 with my best friend also a ww2 enthusiast.
We visited all the museums over there in the coastal area. and also a numerous off sightseeing spots like for instants brecour manor seen in band of brothers in “silencing the guns”
I also have many  pictures  off  collections seen in museums I visited over the last few years.      
So if you have any questions about any museum in either Holland, Belgium, Luxemburg and normandie I  likely will be able to answer  it.

peter
        

Peter, Yes I got your e mail at my address. This jeep aboard the "Queen City" really has my interest. It is
amazing that it survived. Listening and reading people that observed its downing you would think it was
impossible that a jeep could run after that crash. But the more you think of  it the men inside most of cushioned the jeep from serious damage. That picture on Gold Beach is great. My brother Dave and I visited Omaha and Utah, and due to time only saw Pegasus Bridge. There is alot more to see. How did you ever get interested in World War II?

doug wilber  

Hey doug, my interest in ww2 began when as a young boy my grandmother told me story’s of the liberation of Tilburg by the Scottish troops.
How one time shrapnel of a nearby explosion damaged my mothers elderly home.
How my grandfather was arrested by the Germans because of steeling potatoes due of food shortage and was send to jail.
How a young German soldier was housed in my mothers home during the occupation and was later send to Russia to fight and could stop crying because he was so scared of never returning home.
How after the liberation my mother asked to the liberators for “swinggum” because she couldn’t pronounce chewing gum.
Also a German airfield was nearby  cold gilze rijen  and was bombed frequently during the liberation.
And also at school we learned a lot about “the war” ,the Dutch resistance, and for instance the “marshal plan” the allied support to rebuilt Holland after the war, so on so on.
Not even to speak of liberation day over here ,the movies of ww2,the german bunkers that are still visible in Holland ,the museums and lots lots more.
And when after all this your best friend seems to shares the same interest trips and visits to museums are soon made.
But what about our jeep, I think when after checking the reg number at your end  I can go out to search for it.
Maybe through my neighbors, I can check on their story  the told me.
They have told me they know the man who one time owned it and supposedly sold it to an unknown buyer.
And search for the owner of the red painted willy’s  jeep.
I also could place some kind of ad in the local paper.
It would be great to find this jeep because of next years 65 celebration.
I also will send you some pictures of the plaque located in a little chapel dedicated to the holy Mary near our village.

peter

Peter, Thanks for all the images you sent. You have done alot of work. Yes it would be nice to find the jeep from the "Queen City". As you know next year is the 65th Anniversity of Operation Market-Garden. Part of the celebration is to land a Waco glider that is now being built out in California. I hope to be on that glider. I have asked on Don Burgett's forum along with other places on which jeep was on the "Queen City". It looks like an impossible task but you never know. One thing I thought about this glider was it did
kill four Americans, but the jeep that was later used by the Doctor may have saved lifes.
Hopefully their deaths brought life to others.
Doug Wilber

Doug,
Indeed its good to think of the possibility that the jeep may have saved lives.
I will do my very best trying to find answers to two of my questions regarding the queen city
That is to find the exact spot of the queen city’s crashsite and to find the owner of the jeep.
First I will visit the owner of the jeep that bought it from the dokter and I wil see from there.
Also I will visit the “heemkundekring” (historical society) in our village and ask if they know something about the story.
I will keep you up to date of my findings and will keep visiting your forum on a regular base.

peter

Peter, I got a few things going on to confirm the jeep registraion #. How are things going on your end? I am thinking that the jeep must of survived the crash because the
four Americans must of cushioned the jeep from serious damage. Have you talked to    the eyewitness to the crash site. Do you know what kind of battery the Germans had to down the "Queen City"?

doug wilber

Doug,

I also got a few things going on regarding the jeep and the whole story regarding the queen city.
I know several new things that concern the queen city.
I have made up an appointment at the historical society in oisterwijk on Friday to verify this.
Its about the crash site and german battery location.
I know now that the jeep was named “Charley” and had written “Charley” on it when it was discovered and the german battery was probably flak (flug or fliegerabwehrkanone) but what kind of i don't know yet it  was installed near a farmhouse on kerkhove in oisterwijk.
The glider appearently struck a tree before crashing into the ground cruching the nose of the fuselage.
Also I am going to meet the former owner of the jeep as I already told you in my last email.
Also I have spoken to several members of Keep Them rolling, a society of vehicle owners of ww2 in Holland
The are willing to help me find the jeep when I have a  picture of it with the numbers on the hood or the old Dutch  number plate beginning with the letter M and numbers (M stands for the province Brabant.
Brabant is the province of Oisterwijk.
They have told me to visit the archives of Oisterwijk from those day that are kept in Tilburg at the city hall.
Also both the oisterwijk historical society and KTM are interested in publishing the story a soon as the story is complete.
This will be then around July-august ,Also I will visit  our library next week to check out some books on the story.
Also the relatives of dr desain  could be approached if there are any left in oisterwijk.
My best friend Jeroen is also helping along searching the internet for the story.
As you see I am really busy on it but unfortunately my 2 daughters are having their birthday this week  Beau becoming 5 and Renee becoming 7 and that’s also is taking up some time.
Also my wife had here birthday last weekend so busy busy times.

Peter.

Peter, Thanks for the update. Looks like you are keeping busy. I know what it
is like with family and all as I have two daughters also, but both are adults now.
I really enjoyed see them grow up.

Take care,
Doug

Doug,

It was possible to visit  the eyewitness after the glider had chrashed earlier than expected.
He knows the exact crash spot of the glider and was owner off a willys jeep who he says belonged to dr desain.
He told me his story and I will let you know later of my findings.
First I want to check out my visit to the historical society and match those story’s.
I am still not sure about his jeep because I have still no verification of his jeep being our jeep, the registration plate showed in the book and the whereabouts of the jeep today.
Don’t you agree that we have to have absolute proof ore something close to it.
I would like your opinion on this.
But the story of the eyewitness is correct and also the crash site I have now appears to be correct.
I will send you a photocopy of the dr desain jeep and crash site as soon as possible.
I think tomorrow.

peter

Peter, You are right about confirming the jeep as the one aboard the "Queen City" I just send out
two e mails, one to Ft. Campbell, Kentucky, the home of the 101st Airborne Division and another
to the people building the Waco glider, asking if there is a manifast somewhere revealing what #
of the jeep aboard the downed glider. I hope this turns up something.

doug wilber

doug,

the jeep also could have  the girlsname "shirley" on it as written in a book published in oisterwijk.

peter

Doug,

A moment ago I had a phone conversation with another eyewitness who as a boy of 13 had permission to go to the crash site and was there.
He is willing to show it to me and give some information.
He also remembers the jeep of Dr Desain he says.
Lets see if the two eyewitnesses match.
I am now writing down the story of the downing of the “Queen City” so it can be published in the historical society’s magazine of Oisterwijk and see if that brings up something.
Also the letter to the city hall is send to a buddy of me who works there and he past it on directly to the archive, that will probably speed it up.

Peter

Peter, I have send out some questions about the Willys jeep but nothing yet. I
am going away this weekend, to all places but the "Queen City", Cincinnati,      Ohio for a couple of baseball games. I will be back on Monday and want to talk with my website director about posting some of the video of my TV show last Monday. I can also send you a copy if you want.

Take care,
Doug

Doug,
Of course a copy would be very nice.
I went to the city hall and visited the archives.
Nothing new there, probably because the Germans did not allow Dutch police on the crash site so no special report of them in the archives only 2 reports of what we already know.
I made some photo’s of the Kerkhovense street I will mail you those and will give you the info obtained by me while talking to 2 witnesses.
Also went to the church and spoke to a guy who was cleaning up the cemetary, he might be able to come in possession of pictures of the old graves of the Americans who were ones buried there.also asked of photo’s of dr Desain with his willysjeep.
Also a Dakota pilot who made a crash landing near Oisterwijk was buried over here and was also relocated together with the other 4 soldiers.
Tomorrow is the memorial in Tilburg of the Indonesia conflict were I will be present.
Have a nice weekend…..

peter

Doug,

Did you receive my email about the eyewitnesses and crash site pictures??

Peter.

Peter, Yes I did-thanks for the information. I going this afternoon to see my webmaster and see if he
can put parts of last week's TV  interview on this web site. There is about three or four parts that I would   like to see put on, including the information you sent me about the crash of the "Queen City".

doug wilber

doug

check out this website
http://www.coulthart.com/jkhunter.html

also a victom of the german flak in oisterwijk, here they talk about a 20mm flak gun!!probably flak 38 2cm.
you can see some clips on youtube on flak 38 2cm and 20mm flak 38

peter.

doug
the photos on your site are from kerkhovensebaan.
the glider crashed in the kerkhovensestraat.
thats what i discoverd after talking to the eyewitnesses and reading other books of oisterwijk.
i have  send you the photos last week plus the eyewitnessreport.
i think you have that in your posession don't you if not i have to send that email again.
peter.

Doug,

I have a question about the interrogation report from Captain Tiedeman as shown on your website.
Was Tiedeman an eyewitness of the downing of the Queen-City? ore was the interrogation  report made up by him questioning an eyewitness?
If he was an eyewitness it means that Tiedeman and George Anderson are the only 2 Americans that saw the downing of the Queen-City known so far.

Peter

Peter, Five years ago I had a telephone interview with George Anderson,
a glider pilot who was being towed by Captain Tiedeman. Both saw the
left wing of the "Queen City" knocked off and the glider go straight down
which appears to be true sine the crash site was only 100 metres from
the German 20mm flak battery. There are other accounts also including
Courtney Bloom in George Koskimaki's book "Hells Highway". Also on my
website is a link to a Dutch website that has comments from 326th H&S
officer Bob Salley who also saw the glider go down.

doug wilber

Doug,

Is it possible to also put in the 2nd eyewitness acount?

thank you,

peter

Peter, Could you resent me Mr. Verhoeven's account to me.
I seem to be missing it.

doug wilber

Doug,

I think maybe you can findout something more about this soldier/crewmember of a dakota on the forums.
I found some info on the other American who was also buried in Oisterwijk on the st Petrus cemetery.
He was a onboard a Dakota (4)348400 as published in the book Zorgvolle Tijden (something like worried times or something like it)in Oisterwijk in the 90’s.
No further information is given only that this american and the four members of the Queen-City were relocated to Margraten war cemetery in 1946.
Maybe u can use this to retrieve more info?

Peter.

I contacted our local news paper “the NewsKlok” for a short article on the Queen-City to be published.
In this article information is asked about the crash of the Queen-City and its cargo.
It was published in the release of July 9, 2008.
Following story is the translation of the article as published:

Peter van der Linden
With special thanks to: J de Vries

                           RESEARCH ON tHE QUEEN-CITY

Oisterwijker Peter van der Linden is doing research to the circumstances a American glider, the Queen-City crashed on 18 September 1944  in the agricultural area kerkhoven in Oisterwijk.
He is trough channels in contact with relatives of the crew killed in this crash, buried in Oisterwijk and later relocated to the American cemetery in Margraten .


During WW2 a glider crashed in Oisterwijk on 18 September 1944.
It was a victim of German FLAK in Oisterwijk.
The glider crashed in the kerkhovensestreet en was partly destroyed.
On board was a crew of 4 occupants and cargo, a jeep.
Al 4 crewmembers died in the crash and where buried on the cemetery of  st Petrus banden.
The jeep from the glider survived the crash and was taken by the Germans who used it as their staff car.

                            Who can provide information

The story of the glider is published I several books about Oisterwijk during WW2.
Also a picture of the registration plate belonging to the jeep was published.
On this story Peter van der Linden is doing research for relatives of the crew.
He is searching for photo’s of the graves when the Americans where still buried in Oisterwijk.
For other American eye witnesses of the crash of the Queen-City he is searching for the whereabouts of the jeep onboard the glider.
These veterans of WW2 are very curious if the story of the jeep is a myth or a true story.
There is sometimes told by some elderly villagers that the former local j.p Dr Desain was in the possession of the jeep after the war.
For this research he is searching for the following information:

-Does somebody  know where the jeep is now a days?
-Are their still photo’s in somebody possession of the graves during 1944-1945 of the crew  
  killed in the crash?  
- is somebody in the possession of remains of the glider?
- is somebody in the possession of photo’s of Doctor Desain and his jeep with maybe a  
  number plate ore hood numbers on it?
-Are their still any eyewitnesses around that where at the crash site on 19 September 1944?
-Is their somebody that knows something more about this story?

Peter, Looks like a good article in the newspaper. Hopefully, some more
information may develop. How big is your village today and what was its
population back in 1944?

doug wilber

Doug,

The population of Oisterwijk was 8400 in 1944.
Now a days its 26000.
For my next article in a local magazine I need some additional information about the 326th.
Can you tell me if the 326th assignment was to help build the baily bridge in Son?
I red in Don Burgetts book that they helped with the building of the bridge but were they suppose to when
they left England on the 18th during Market Garden?
I also red in don’s book that the Combat Engineers of  the 326th were assigned to other tasks.

peter

somebody quots G Thuringens studie on Groesbeek Market-Garden in a send email to me this evening.
He wrote:
             1 McCann,                     Noel C.                   Pilot 1e.Lt.               Nr. T122016           Norwood               OHIO    
             2 Hiltunen,                    R.J.                        1e.Lt.                      Nr. 1103214           Margraten             K - 6 - 16
             3 Lemay,                      Robert J.                 Tec./ 5                    Nr. 36239073         Margraten              L - 9 - 11
             4 Carson,                      Raymond L.            Driver / Pte.             Nr. 36176352         Margraten              M - 19 - 1
             5 Unknouw                    unknown                 Farmers?

unknown as farmers:
was it a killed Oisterwijker it would have been known.
could "unknown"it be an interpreter ore secret agent just as in another glider with the Dutch Klaas Luitwieler, Commando Sergeant and interpreter from the Irene Brigade.
Peter

Peter, From all I know only four were in the Queen City. I never heard of anyone else                               and I believe that would have put the glider overweight, not that that didn't happen.
Maybe it was a stranger from the area who happened to be going by?

doug wilber

Peter, Getting back to the 326th Airborne Engineers. The Engineers fought most of the time
with other units. On D-Day a platoon each of Charlie Company landed with the 501st, 502nd
and 506th PIRs. Their mission was mainly to blow up any bridges to stop a German counter
attack. Remember they were the demolition experts so they could built things but also knew
how to destroy them. A few Engineers landed by glider along with a mini bulldozer which was
to be used to clear the landing zones of Rommel asparagus(poles placed to cripple gliders).
The rest laned by troopship. In Operation Market Garden, Charlie Company had one platoon                     lland with the 506th, while 2 landed with the 502nd. One platoon of Baker and Able each landed with
the 501st. Their job was to build bridges if necessary but again they ended up fighting as
infantrymen which they did alot. Their other tasks were to lay mine fields, place trip flares, build
defensive systems- a number of things. In Bastogne, the 326th fought as a complete unit and
had their own sector in the southern defensive zone of Bastogne. As you may know they not only
were the first unit in Bastogne but also the first unit to meet Patton's tanks. In Bastogne they also
suffered their heaviest losses due the fact they deployed as infantry. Many of my father's friends
were killed there which bothered him because he wasn't there. My Dad's main company was Baker
which saw 35 men killed and 60 wounded or captured of the orginial 99, the most of the 326th.
Anymore information I willl try to get for you.

doug wilber

Doug,

Do you know what happened with the Dakota that was towing the Queen-City?
Is it possible that it also crashed?

Peter.

Peter, A few years ago I talked with glider pilot George Anderson of
Herkimer, NY, who was Noel McCann's best friend. He was being towed by
Captain Tiedemann who issued the missing pilots report. From all of my
accounts, the C-47 Dakota, flown by Lt. Maynard, that was towing the Queen
City returned to England. Remember they would have to release the tow line
of the doomed glider to prevent their plane from being dragged down.

doug wilber

Doug,

I was a bit confused by a 3rd eyewitness who phoned me about my story in the newspaper.
He apparently saw the whole thing happening before his eyes.
I have made an appointment with him after my holyday so in about 3-4 weeks.
Until now he has told me being a boy of 14 years old he saw that the Dakota got hit and releasing his towline and making a left turn, apparently he is under the impression the Dakota crashed after releasing his towline in a little village not far from Oisterwijk called Biesthoutakker.
I have posted this earlier on your forum (Near Huize Assisie an other Dakota with damaged engines crash landed) page 1 in the queen city discussion.
When I asked him whether the tow line was released by the glider he said no it went down with the glider still attached over the full length.
I asked him if it was falling like a leave on a tree as published in the book and he said no I saw the wing got shot of and the glider went strait down.
He was not on the location of the crash site until after a few days when the glider was still there.
He didn’t know what happened with the glider after those few days.
Also he sais to remember seeing the jeep used by the Germans near the leather company.

So Doug I thought about the following,
Could you make some kind of list of questions you would like me to ask him?
Maybe some specific details about glider ore tow plane.
What ever it is just put it on your list and email it to me.
Then I will see what I can ad to your list of questions my self so no questions are forgotten.

Peter.

Quoted from peter van der linden

doug

check out this website
http://www.coulthart.com/jkhunter.html

also a victom of the german flak in oisterwijk, here they talk about a 20mm flak gun!!probably flak 38 2cm.
you can see some clips on youtube on flak 38 2cm and 20mm flak 38

peter.

Hunter's crew
Visit to Margraten 23-07-08

peter

Queen-City's crew, Margraten 23-07-08

Peter.

Peter, Great photos. What's the story with the lawn in some of the pictures?
When I was there four years ago, the lawn seemed to be perfect as it was
with the cemetry in Normandy.

doug wilber

Doug,

On my visit they were mowing the lawn.
Due to the sun burning on the fresh gras after mowing it was brown collored,but that will go away after a while they told me.
And at the looks of it they were doing a great job,doing it in a pattern way to make it look beautiful.
It has to be a lot of work keeping these little monuments in top chape for future years to come.

Peter

Doug,

Was it McCann's first glider mission ore did he flew other missions before Market-Garden forinstance Normandie?

Peter.

Peter, Years ago when I was talking with the great granddaughter of Flight/Officer
Noel McCann, she said he was a pilot in the invasion of Southern France in August
1944. I could ask glider expert Charles Day as he may have documentation on that.
Their were two American glider pilots who flew five combat missions, Sicily, Normandy,
Southern France, Bastogne and Germany.

doug wilber

Doug,

That invasion is operation dragoon on 15 August between Toulon and Cannes, Southern France.
I ones read that included in the invasion was the glider-carried 887th Airborne Engineer Aviation Company, which holds the distinction of being the only Airborne Engineer Aviation unit in the European Theater to carry out the mission for which it was trained – conducting a combat glider landing with engineer equipment.

Peter

Peter, Just recieved an e mail from glider expert, Charles Day. He said
that F/O McCann was on his first mission. He also stated that McCann
ended up in a different squadron than he was assigned. Remember
Operation Market-Garden had a shortage of qualified pilots so there were
many gaps to be filled.

doug wilber  

Quoted from peter van der linden

Doug,

I think maybe you can findout something more about this soldier/crewmember of a dakota on the forums.
I found some info on the other American who was also buried in Oisterwijk on the st Petrus cemetery.
He was a onboard a Dakota (4)348400 as published in the book Zorgvolle Tijden (something like worried times or something like it)in Oisterwijk in the 90’s.
No further information is given only that this american and the four members of the Queen-City were relocated to Margraten war cemetery in 1946.
Maybe u can use this to retrieve more info?

Peter.

Jerauld I. Cutts
Staff Sergeant, U.S. Army Air Forces
Service # 19136125
96th Squadron, 440th Troop Carrier Group  
Entered the Service from: Oregon
Died: 23-Sep-44
Buried at: Plot I Row 18 Grave 7
Netherlands American Cemetery
Margraten, Netherlands  
Awards: Air Medal with Oak Leaf Cluster, Purple Heart

Peter.

Peter, I was thinking about the downing of the Queen City and was
wondering the size of the German flak gun. Was it a 20mm or 38mm
cannon? The reason I am asking is that if is closer to a 40mm gun
the explosion would have great impact, possibly killing or knocking out
all aboard. It could also burn some of the occupants of the glider, that
is why they thought one was a Negro? I would like to get that Air Force
report that was done only a few years ago. That would settle alot of
questions.

doug wilber

Doug,

The gun was a 20mm and shot about 90 tracerbullits a minut and began shooting when its target was in a range of about 1,5 to 2 km
The gun size is confirmed in several story's published about Oisterwijk during the war.
Also on the Hunter website its said that it was a 20mm flak gun.

Peter.

Doug,

I found a photo of the cemetery in Oisterwijk where the crew of the Queen-City was buried
Also after our liberation other soldiers were buried beside the 5 Americans.
I don’t know if the big crosses are from the Americans but in the photo there’s in Dutch” the burial of the Scots” written.
I don’t know who the other people are in the photo.

Peter.

Doug,

2 new flak positions 1 near the rail road on the area called nevelo and 1 where there used to be a field near the udenhoutseroad.
The last one also shot at the Queen-City because it flew right over the house of an eye witness i spoke to recently.
The presumable flight path of the Queen-City is also marked, with a white line.

Peter.

Doug,

My neighbour has requested to post the following poem on this forum.
Which might be of intrest to you.
As part of this poem is engraved on the walls of Margraten cemetry.

Kindest regards Mrs De Jong

IN FLANDERS FIELDS the poppies blow
Between the crosses row on row,
That mark our place; and in the sky
The larks, still bravely singing, fly
Scarce heard amid the guns below.

We are the Dead. Short days ago
We lived, felt dawn, saw sunset glow,
Loved and were loved, and now we lie
In Flanders fields.

Take up our quarrel with the foe:
To you from failing hands we throw
The torch; be yours to hold it high.
If ye break faith with us who die
We shall not sleep, though poppies grow
In Flanders fields.

Rest ye in peace, ye Flanders dead.
The fight that ye so bravely led
We've taken up. And we will keep
True faith with you who lie asleep
With each a cross to mark his bed,
In Flanders fields.
Fear not that ye have died for naught.
The torch ye threw to us we caught.
Ten million hands will hold it high,
And Freedom's light shall never die!
We've learned the lesson that ye taught
In Flanders fields.

there i saw these lines many a time mentioned.
At varius times in Normandie this line is used.
Lest we forget, lest we forget.

Peter.

God of our fathers, known of old--
   Lord of our far-flung battle line
Beneath whose awful hand we hold
   Dominion over palm and pine--
Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,
Lest we forget - lest we forget!

The tumult and the shouting dies;
   The captains and the kings depart:
Still stands Thine ancient sacrifice,
   An humble and a contrite heart.
Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,
Lest we forget - lest we forget!

Far-called, our navies melt away;
   On dune and headland sinks the fire:
Lo, all our pomp of yesterday
   Is one with Nineveh and Tyre!
Judge of the Nations, spare us yet,
Lest we forget - lest we forget!

If, drunk with sight of power, we loose
   Wild tongues that have not Thee in awe--
Such boasting as the Gentiles use
   Or lesser breeds without the law--
Lord God of Hosts, be with us yet,
Lest we forget - lest we forget!

For heathen heart that puts her trust
   In reeking tube and iron shard--
All valiant dust that builds on dust,
   And guarding, calls not Thee to guard--
For frantic boast and foolish word,
Thy mercy on Thy people, Lord!

Peter and Mrs. De Jong, Thank you posting these two poems. The one thing
we should always remember are the dead from these wars and what a waste of
humanity it was. Today Europe is free from war because they realized that there
is better ways to resolve issues. Maybe if the politicians from earlier years didn't
try to force an impossible treaty on people there would never had been this
slaughterhouse. Upwards to 85 million people died during World War II  and lets
remember the victims of that conflict by never having an out of control event take place.

doug wilber

I found a list of axis and allied planes that came down during the war in Oisterwijk.
The planes came down because of engine failure and flak.
Also a little map is shown of Oisterwijk and surounding villages with the crash locations

Peter.

18 sept 1944.
Liberator (4)440210 us.
Shot down by German FLAK in agricultural area called kerkhoven in Oisterwijk.
Crashed in the village Winkel no.1 on map.
9 out of 10 crewmembers killed.
additional info http://www.coulthart.com/jkhunter.html
Pictures of Margraten cementry on page 4 of the subject "queen-city" you are in now.

peter

18 sept 1944.
Dakota "S".no tail number only the letter S
Shot down by German Flak in agricultural area kerkhoven,Oisterwijk.
Crashed near monostarie assisie,no2 on map.
At least 4 suvivors.

Peter.

Spring 1945.
Emengency landing British Mustang.
Area called Holleneind near Oisterwijk.no3 on map.
No further info.

peter.

18 sept 1944.
Waco glider Queen-City.
no4 on map.

peter.

1942.
German Fieseler Storch.
Emergency landing in the schijfstreet,Oisterwijk.
no5 on map.

Peter.

18 sept 1944.
2 horsa gliders.
Early landing in Oisterwijk.
54 suvivors.
no6 on map.
Also in subject Airbornes in Oisterwijk on this forum.

peter.

sept/okt 1944.
Emergency landing due to engine failure of a British Spitfire.
Oisterwijksebaan,area heukelom in Oisterwijk no7 on map.
1 survivor.

Peter.

Peter, I would guess the two Horsa gliders that landed near your hometown
were suppose to land near Arnhem? I guess somebody was lost.

doug wilber

26 july 1943.
Halifax bomber.
Shot down by a German fighter after a raid on Essen Germany.
Crashed about 4,5 km from Oisterwijk.
5 deaths,2 suvivors.
no8 on map.

peter.

Spring 1945.
Emergency landing of a British Mosquito, Oisterwijksebaan in Oisterwijk.
2 suvivors.
no9 on map.

peter.

aug 1 1942.
Hampden bomber Shotdown by a German fighter.
Emergency landing near Oisterwijk.
Came from a mission to Dusseldorf,Germany.
2 deaths 2 suvivors.
no10 on map.

peter

Spring 1945.
British Tempest.
Emergency landing little Oisterwijkse heather,Oisterwijk.
1 suvivor,no11 on map.

peter.

Sept 23 1944.
Dakota (4)348400 tugplane.
Shot by German flak at schijndel,Holland
Emergencylanding  little Oisterwijkse heather,Oisterwijk.
1 death 4 suvivors.
no11 on map.

Peter.

Peter, I would guess the two Horsa gliders that landed near your hometown
were suppose to land near Arnhem? I guess somebody was lost.

doug wilber


Doug, Probably yes,a navigation error is mentioned in the books overhere.
Maybe this is one of the tug planes? All the info i have on these pictures is 'a dakota in a little lake on the kampina heather'.

peter

What I found until now trough the internet is that apparently this C47A piloted by 1/Lt.J.Webster,436 TCG/81 Sqdr came down at 1500u between Esch (south of Vught) and Oisterwijk.

Peter.

18 Sept 1944.

From this airfield the mission of both serial, A-41 and A-53 to fly over on Sept 18 the main parts of the 326th Airborne Engineers  to the Son LZ-W took place.
Also on that day the Queen-City took of from this airfield.

Peter.

Peter, Thanks for all the pictures and postings. It seems your town had alot of
activity during the war. That C-47 that crashed in the lake, do you have any information
about this plane? Also how far are you from Arnhem?

doug wilber

Doug,

I have now further information on the C-47,maybe the "L" and tailnumber can tell you something?
Arnhem is about 80 km from Oisterwijk a one hour drive.

Peter.

Quoted from peter van der linden

26 july 1943.
Halifax bomber.
Shot down by a German fighter after a raid on Essen Germany.
Crashed about 4,5 km from Oisterwijk.
5 deaths,2 suvivors.
no8 on map.

peter.

Quoted from peter van der linden

sept/okt 1944.
Emergency landing due to engine failure of a British Spitfire.
Oisterwijksebaan,area heukelom in Oisterwijk no7 on map.
1 survivor.

Peter.

Peter, I imagine that is the right wheel cover for the Spitfire?

doug wilber

Doug,
It depends on what end of the plane you are standing, if you study the shape at the bottom and rectangular line.
The shape is like this for taxi (tail down) and take off(tail up).
Wood you stand in front of the plain it would be on the right hand site of the left landing gear.
Then it was positioned under the left wings landing gear.
Peter

Doug, can you confirm the Queen-City was part of 442 TCG/ 303rd Squadron?
Peter.

Peter, F/O Noel McCann was in the 442nd TCG either the 303rd or 304th since there was
two serials A-41(303) and A-53 (304), I don't know which one. I looked around because I
thought Charles Day said which squadron it was. Well I guess I will ask him again.

Doug

Peter, Any thing new about the "Queen City"? The articles looked really good.
I did some video on a B-17, B-24 and B-25 along with a P-51C two seater at
my airport last weekend. Interviewed a B-17 pilot who was shot down and a POW
for 5 months.

Doug

Doug, nothing new at the moment, but if there is something new will post it on this forum.
Was the B17 pilot shot down over Europe and do you know what stalag he was in?
Peter.

Peter, I interviewed Earl Morrow on my new camera and hope to have it on
the website later. He spent five months as a POW and traveled abit. They had
a newspaper article on him so I will look it up on where he went. One thing he
mentioned was he lost about 55 pounds in that 5 months as everyone, including
the guards lacked food. He also was not happy about the fighter escort as they
chased after German fighters and other fighters -FW-190s and ME-111s shot
down his bomber killing three of the crew. The Tuskegee Airman-an all-Black
pilot squardon-always stayed with the bombers and went thru the entire war
without losing one bomber.

Doug,i just watched some great photo's of that day where I think you were also present.
This is the web page,
http://www.smugmug.com/gallery/6181025_TXB2B/1/389805772_dg7vt#389805772_dg7vt
Enjoy.
Peter.

Peter, Some more information on B-17 pilot Earl Morrow. He once returned from a mission in which
3 of his 4 engines were out. He was flying so low that he wasn't sure he could clear the white clifffs of
Dover. The Flying Fortress did land and had 100 punctures in the fuselage from enemy fire including
some as large as a manhole cover. In November 1944 over Eastern Germany on his 17th mission his
plane was hit by German fighters after four passes. He pushed his wounded co-pilot out the plane and
10 seconds after he bailed out the plane exploded killing two gunners and the radio operator. He was
shifted around POW camps until he ended up in Nuremburg where he stayed. In April, 1945 an American
tank crashed thru the front gate. Moments later General George Patton stood at attention before the
liberating prisoners. who saluted Morrow and the others and then moved on. He said, "OK fellas, I've
got a war to win".

Quoted from glider326

Peter, F/O Noel McCann was in the 442nd TCG either the 303rd or 304th since there was
two serials A-41(303) and A-53 (304), I don't know which one. I looked around because I
thought Charles Day said which squadron it was. Well I guess I will ask him again.

Doug

Doug,
Where you able to get an answer to my question?
Peter.