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doug wilber
June 16, 2008, 4:36pm Report to Moderator
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Peter, Just got back from New York City for Father's Day and my youngest
daughter's birthday. It was a great time.
Thanks for the RAF photos. Can the German flak gun be seen in these
photos? It appears the distance from the German 20 mm flak gun
and the crash site was quite short. What distance would you guess?

doug wilber
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peter van der linden
June 16, 2008, 7:21pm Report to Moderator

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Doug,

congratulations with your daughters birthday.

let me answer your questions.
On the 17 of September the Germans positioned their FLAK further up the road to the north on the right side at another farmhouse.
The Germans made several big holes in the ground to put in their FLAK.
When they were just in position 2 English reconnaissance planes came over the area.
Because the FLAK was not camouflaged yet they were soon spotted and directly after this 4 American thunderbolts appeared on the horizon and engaged the battery.
The battery is fully destroyed and wounded Germans are taken from the seen.
After this a great armada of planes came overhead from the west and the sky is black of planes.
The only thing the Germans can do is look helplessly at it while they fly over their destroyed position
So i think the Germans knew the allies were coming past Oisterwijk and there for positioned their FLAK in that area(Kerkhove)
They had more antiaircraft in Oisterwijk during the war but I think it was because of the German airbase Eindhoven and Gilze Rijen.
When there had been a bombing rade in Germany and planes were hit by enemy fire and in state of emergency they had to fly from Germany to a emergency airfield in the south of England over Belgium.
Then the route was over the province of Brabant Holland and then they had to avoid the airfields Eindhoven and Gilze rijen.
So they flew over the Tilburg area just in between, also they had to avoid the Denbosch Boxtel Best area because of German FLAK and this is why they then came over Oisterwijk.
This is also why more than ones a plane was shot down in this area during the war and that’s why their was FLAK around Oisterwijk.
Also for the protection of their ammunition depots in our Forrest, the depots at the leather company and our railway used by the Germans for their loading and unloading of goods and ammunition at the railway emplacement on the leather company.
Sadly on 16 September 6 typhoons attack one of those trains fully loaded with ammunition in our village centre and blow it up destroying the surrounding area to a great extend.
600 houses are destroyed ore badly damaged but as a wonder know an was killed.
Sadly the RAF pictures on the internet are from 13 September.

In a another book I have red about the downing of the glider is written:
the glider crashed in the ditch of kerkhovense street about 75 meters from the canon beside the farm of Mr van der Sterren  
while first hitting the tree's.
I think the Germans had their FLAK set up beside the road under cover of the tree line just in the field.
This I think because 1 eyewitness remembers going by the FLAK several times and saw the canon under its camouflage.
I have made a circle beside the farmhouse of Mr van der Sterren so think of the FLAK as being in that circle beside the road at a distance of 75 to 125 meter to the crash spot.
The crash spot is marked with a arrow and it could be possible that the spot is just a little closer to the farmhouse of van der Sterren.
But keep it in the field I have marked.
Could it be possible that the FLAK shot of the wing of the glider to the left of its position and overflew the gun while going down in a sort  of spin crashing in the tree's and ending in the ditch?
In the copy of the book with the reg plate you have is written in Dutch "the glider came down as a leaf falling from a tree".

Peter.

ps. i also had a great fathers day, got me an orange candle from beau and a red neck tie with I love you on it from renee haha
     had to wear it all day long and let me tell you I’m not used  wearing those things so it was a killer




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"Think not only upon there passing...Remember the GLORY of their spirit"
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peter van der linden
June 16, 2008, 9:03pm Report to Moderator

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Monument in Oisterwijk of the amunitiontrain explosion on 16 September 1944.

Peter.



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peter van der linden
June 16, 2008, 9:18pm Report to Moderator

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Small circle farmhouse van der Sterren.
Big circle leather company.

Peter.



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doug wilber
June 17, 2008, 12:16am Report to Moderator
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Peter, Ah yes Father's Day. Once I had to wear a crown.
This last weekend was alot of fun being with my two kids.
After dining out Saturday, Margaret and Erin ran together in a five mile
race in Central Park, NYC. I am walking in the park on a path and
Larry, my daughter's boyfriend said -did you see who we just passed?
No, -it was the actor Michael Douglas walking with his two young children.
His Dad, Kirk, was born and raised in Amsterdam, NY only a few miles
from Schenectady and use to come to my city to party. Later,
we attended a New York Mets ballgame.Mets lost, they stink!
But it was fun, alot of foul balls coming near us and five home runs.
The Germans were experts at warfare. I remember seeing a movie
on the American Revolutionary War and the Germans were considered
the top in the world at that time. If you look at the American Army today
you see so much influence from the Germans. 30% of the Americans that
fought in Europe during WWII were of German decent. This meant cousins
were fighting cousins. I am half German myself. The downing of the Queen
interests me. Captain Joe Crilley, a painter and ranking officer of the 326th
was roomates with Hlitunen. The glider crashed with the tow line still attached?
I can't believe that were 600 homes destroyed or damaged and no deaths.

doug wilber
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peter van der linden
June 17, 2008, 10:25pm Report to Moderator

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Doug,

Yes luckily nobody was killed because it took the planes two runs to bomb their target with
how do you call bombs with fuel in it ,I don’t know the word writh now sorry.
The Oisterwijkers had enough time to seek shelter in their airraid cellars and only 1 person was wounded.
I don’t know for sure if the rope was still attached to the glider but it could be possible if mc Cann ore Hiltunen had the opportunity to unttache that they would I think, but as far as I know it was hanging in the tree just across the gliders crash spot according to 2 witnesses so I guess it was still attached to the glider.
Is a thing to keep in mind when I will be able to speak to maybe other eyewitnesses who were there in 1944.
There is going to be a little story in our newspaper next week about my surge were I will be asking for info and material about the downing of the queen city and the willys jeep so I hope that’s going to bring up some new information.
Also wrote a letter to the museum wings of liberty in Best near Son with a very nice story of our surge for the jeep and the downing of the queen city.
And  told in the letter about your website.
Also emailed the owner of the red jeep 2 times that is seen during festivals in our village.
Seems it was ones owned by our fire department and is now in private hands.(that’s why its red)
Still waiting for his apply so still busy whit the jeep.
In week 26 there will be a story of the queen-city in our local magazine and a personal interview about me and our surge for the jeep.
I am still not able to see any FLAK in the pictures.
when I study them on my  computer screen and zooming in on a area its making the picture some what unclear but I was able to recognize the field hospital by its red cross painted on the roof of the building.
But maybe my father in law who is from this village will be able to remember some Flak positions when he sees the pictures.
Sadly he was to young to remember it very well but maybe a story will popup.
But I will post the picture if I find something on it.
If you want I will post the picture with the red cross on the roof of the German field hospital.
My father in law told me how clever the Germans were on their ammunition trains, he told me they had several train sections  painted with a red and white cross to give the impression it were hospital sections.
I have a picture of 18 Sept with 2 sections of 4 carrages, ironically it were probably the ones that were bombed 3 days later.
I also can upload them on the forum if you want to.
No problemo.
Will check in tomorrow for the answer.

Peter.


                               
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doug wilber
June 17, 2008, 11:02pm Report to Moderator
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The word is naplam. A very deadly weapon which I think is illegal in warfare
today. The Germans forces in WWII were met with constant Jabos, the
attacking aircraft of the Allied Air Force. This was the result of the production
of aircraft by the Allies, most notably the USA. The fact they could not only
mass produce aircraft, they also had to mass produce pilots. Over 4,000
American pilots were killed in training only during the less than four years of
the war.

doug wilber

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peter van der linden
June 18, 2008, 8:12pm Report to Moderator

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Maybe some flak positions.
Close to the railway are most posible.

Train wagons on the tracks.

Field hospital and st Petrus church.

Peter.
P.s have a nice 501st PIR Reunion.....



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June 24, 2008, 7:29pm Report to Moderator

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Posted more of Peter's photos and the RAF reconnnaissance photos on the Queen City page.

http://www.thewoundingofcharliewilber.com/queen_city.html
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